So You Want to Start a Trucking Company to Haul Water in the North Dakota Oilpatch

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The Query

This morning, a gentleman who’s considering starting up his own trucking company to haul water in the North Dakota oil drilling boom asked a number of very logical questions. The answers added up to a complete post…and here it is, beginning with his wanting to know whether not I’d ever actually worked in North Dakota

My Industry Background

Back in the early eighties, I drove bulk cement tankers for Halliburton and later worked as a derrick hand for Western Oil Well Services on the workover rigs. Both operations were based out of Glendive, Montana, and a lot of our work was across the line into western North Dakota.

Also, my (late) grandparents lived on the Rez at Mandaree, ND, and I visited there as well, adding to an already clear understanding of the terrain and climate.

In total, over the years, energy industry work (involving drilling and production operations for both oil and natural gas) included assignments that took me to the following states: Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, Colorado, and Utah.

The final years in the industry were as a water hauler for the gasfield drilling boom in western Colorado. Toward the end, I even started up my own trucking company (Tryad Transport, Inc.), for which the truck financing fell through at literally the last moment. The lender closed its doors forever on the day Obama was elected President.

I’m still steamed about that.

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Answering the Man’s Questions

Starting up a water hauling company can be a fine thing, though I have to cringe a little at the thought of a man doing that with zero upfront experience in the oilpatch. Not that it can’t be done; more than one of the smaller trucking outfits contracted to my former employer in Colorado did just that.

Pay is by the hour, so much per truck-and-driver, on contract between the trucking company and the oil company. I don’t know what would be competitive in North Dakota at the moment; you’d really need to go talk to some folks in the area to get a feel for that. A fairly typical rate in western Colorado a few years ago (2007-2009) was running around $100-$135 per hour for a tractor-trailer combo, give or take, but pricing is all free market competition.

Volume does count in the sense that oil companies, just like anybody else, want the best bang for the buck they can get. The baseline tanker size is 130 barrels for a semi trailer and 80 barrels for a bobtail (straight truck with chassis-mounted tank). If you run larger tanks than that, you’ll have an edge with some potential employers, but there are downsides, too:

1. Heavier loads mean OSOW (oversize overweight) permitting with the state.

2. Heavier loads can tip over more easily and/or get stuck deeper in the mud.

3. Bigger tanks are more expensive to purchase and harder on the running gears that carry them, so you’ve got a couple of cost factors there.

Best rigs to equip with:

This is to a large degree a matter of personal taste. For example, I’m partial to International trucks and would definitely run those exclusively if I had my druthers. But Peterbilt, Kenworth, and Mack all have their advocates in the oil patch.

Mack does present a unique problem in that their parts are proprietary; you can only get them from a Mack dealership.

As for tanks, I’m most familiar with the Troxell and Dragon brands, both of which are well made, but there could be others out there by now that work just as well (I’ve been out of the patch since April ’09.)

Vacuum pumps are most important items, but discussing those is a whole ‘nother story. I’d do some walking and talking to existing drivers in North Dakota before I picked a pump brand. Going the wrong route with one of those can mess up your entire operation. Some are a lot more rugged than others, some are noisy enough to deafen a driver over time, etc.

Whatever dealership or specialty shop sets up your trucks for the oil patch needs to know what he’s doing, and you’re going to want axles and suspension that are as heavy duty as possible. The patch is a rough neighborhood when it comes to equipment, and I’ve seen many a unit sidelined with a busted spring or a rear axle that snapped because the owner didn’t beef things up in time.

Heavy duty rear ends are essential.

Sound like a lot to take in? Oh, it is! Certainly more than a brief written page like this can cover adequately.

Who to contact: There’s only one sure way to find that out. Namely, take a week, spend some time in the area you’re targeting, and talk to people who are doing the work you want to do. Some of the company owners with whom you’ll be competing will brush you off, but there are always drivers at the nearest coffee shop who will give you the straight scoop.

Carry a notebook, maybe a voice recorder. Do the legwork.

Find out, also, what sort of Safety Program will be required to keep you in D.O.T. compliance. It might be startling to most liberals, but the oilpatch is an extremely safety-minded place, and there are hoops you’ll need to jump through to keep State Inspectors (and the company hands paying you to haul their water) happy.

Until or unless your new company grows large enough to allow you to have “old” drivers train new drivers, be careful who you hire to drive your trucks. It only takes one idiot who neither knows nor cares enough to cut down his air pressure to five psi or less when his tank is nearly empty…plus the receiving tank being nearly full…to result in a massive splash-over-the-top water spill.

If that happens to be fresh water, few company or state or federal authorities are likely to care too much. But if it happens to be nasty stuff from downhole, carrying all sorts of toxins and carcinogens and other horrible, smelly chemicals, it could put you out of business in a heartbeat.

Is it worth doing? Oh, you betcha! My former employer in Colorado grew their little three-truck startup to a sizeable operation fielding more than sixty power units in something under three years worth of hard-charging time and effort.

That is the American Dream in action.

15 thoughts on “So You Want to Start a Trucking Company to Haul Water in the North Dakota Oilpatch

  1. Hi, I enjoy reading your site. Ref. vac pumps to haul water, which brand do you recommend? thanks

  2. Case, I’ve been out of the oil patch almost six years now and probably shouldn’t recommend one way or the other; there might be better brands out there now that I know nothing about. That said, I worked with more Masport pumps than anything else (this was from 2006 to 2009), and they worked well.

  3. I’m from the UK, almost 16 years old. I’ve managed to convince my parents to move to Rapid City, SD. I have a passion for trucking but want to be a millionaire. London is boring for me and European trucks are uncomfortable

    If I got $500,000 worth of capital, from investors (family friends, relatives, etc), what could I do? Who could I hire to start a company?

    My Skype is MuzzaHukka, and my phone number is +447831369310, you can call me after 10:30am South Dakota time weekdays, anytime after 5am weekends. I can also be reached on WhatsApp with the same number

  4. Okay, Ivan, here’s the deal (from my perspective only):

    1. No way I’m going to call or otherwise contact you; I have neither the time nor the motivation to do so.

    2. However, if I can give you a tip or two on this page, I’ll do that. a if you want to have a continuing conversation here, in this way, that would be fine.

    3. If you raised $500,000 and hired people to start a company, odds are you’d find out you were dead broke again in fairly short order. Hiring someone else to run an operation about which you yourself know nothing is a sure recipe for disaster. Anyone who’d take the job (with you paying all the company’s expenses including employee salaries or wages) would, more likely than not, either rip you off or turn out to be a bumbling incompetent who ran your new company INTO the ground even before it got OFF the ground. If a man is good enough to run a company successfully, he’ll either be handling his own operation or hooking up with an established company; he won’t go with a startup.

    4. That said, there’s nothing wrong with wanting to be a millionaire…but throwing money at the problem is not the way to get there. (Incidentally, I happen to love Rapid City, have lived there before, and consider South Dakota my “second home”.)

    5. In order to run a successful trucking company–which could certainly combine your desire for the big bucks and your passion for trucking–you need to KNOW trucking. You, yourself, personally. Nobody else. You’ll eventually want to hire people UNDER you, but not at the head of the company, and you need to be able to KNOW if they are doing their jobs well…or not.

    6. Obviously, you’re not a patient man. Persistent, I would guess. And believe me, I can relate. But to succeed at your chosen goal, your best bet is to become a truck driver for a while…which I’m sure you already realize cannot be legally accomplished until you’re a bit older. A century ago, you bet, but these days there’s nothing like an oversized government full of paperwork and rules and smothering regulation to make a young entrepeneur’s life utterly miserable.

    7. So…what else might you be able to do while you’re waiting for the calendar to give you the go-ahead to get your CDL? Well…get a job in a truck stop, maybe, like the Windmill in Rapid or whatever the one out east of town is called. Heck, learn to bust tires, grease a fifth wheel, or for that matter wait tables and talk to truckers as you can.

    8. Equally important, however, is schooling. I don’t mean high school or college, but specific schooling that can directly help your ability to run a business. Study the D.O.T. and I.R.S. regulations for truckers, hours of service regs, accounting–without at least some awareness of accounting, failure is certain soon or later–insurance requirements, markets for different types of trucks, big rig maintenance, and of course take a deep look at all the infinite different possibilities for truckers. Do you want to run your truck, and later your company, in the oil patch? If so, how do you spec out a tanker to survive the harsh off road conditions? Maybe a bedbug hauler, what furniture movers are often called? Reefers, refrigerated vans hauling produce and other perishable goods? Flatbeds, where every load has to be secured with straps or chains and often covered with tarps against the weather? Grain haulers? Water? Hazardous materials like gasoline, liquid nitrogen, etc.? How are you going to compete for your loads against the thousands of other truckers out there?

    In other words, Ivan, there’s a world of KNOWLEDGE out there, and to reach your stated goal as a millionaire trucking company owner, you absolutely must have a few years of both intense study and intense direct experience before you can give it a real shot.

  5. Ghost32, thanks for your quick and informing reply!

    I read that you can get a CDL at 16 in the state of South Dakota. The problem is, my mom should be getting a work visa to be a hair dresser, whereas me, my father and my younger brother would be their “dependants”.

    When I searched for jobs and emailed them, they told me they require people to be 21+ and have 3 years of experience. My question is: Is this a paradox? Get a job… to get a job?

    Are there companies or people I can work for, perhaps even for free or for very little, that could accept a mature young trucker? My parents have driven around Europe, and whilst the terrain and style of driving is different, we can both endure sitting for long periods and driving long distances. I understand that it’s a very dangerous job, and me being young gives me energy and good eyesight 😉

    Where you said “hooking up with an established company”, can I be part of a chain? Start a warehouse/garage/repair shop for a specific range of trucks/companies?

    Would it be better to open a repair shop with mechanics (after I’ve gained mechanical experience) that repair trucks, rather than manage route planning, driving, inspections, etc?

    Thanks

  6. Ivan, you ask some very good questions.

    First, a few more words about CDL’s. In the States, there are different classes of commercial driver’s licenses. The big rigs (18 wheelers) all require what’s known as a Class A, usually with a few added endorsements (for pulling tankers, doubles, triples, HazMat, or whatever). But if you start out doing driving that “only” requires a Class B CDL, such as perhaps making local deliveries for a snack food or soft drink company using a step van or some such, you might be able to get your foot in the door that way before, thus gaining “experience”.

    It is quite true that very few over the road or oil patch trucking companies will look at a driver under the age of 21. And yes, the “get a job to get a job” situation is a bit of a paradox. It was totally different in the early 1980’s when I got my first commercial license–but that was before the CDL system came into being.

    One major reason for employer reluctance to hire young drivers is the underwriting restriction required by the insurance companies; their people know that statistically speaking, younger drivers (under 21 especially) have a higher accident rate than older drivers do, and they discriminate accordingly. Unfortunately, most of the underwriters making those decisions are bound by their own rule books and are looking to cover their own rear ends more than anything else.

    That said, there are occasional, if very rare, exceptions. On my last driving job in the Colorado drilling boom, one of my best friends was a 22 year old driver when I met him. He’d been doing it for a while, too–certainly more than a year; I believe he’d been driving commercially since he was around 19 or so. (He’d also ridden bulls professionally on the rodeo circuit for a while, as I did in my younger years, and he’d once won a major Championship at Casper, Wyoming. Then again, he’d gotten his face smashed in by a bull once, too, and had quite a bit of metal under the skin, holding things together.)

    I’ve never really thought of truck driving as a “very dangerous job”, but that’s probably because of the OTHER things I’ve done such as pro rodeo, underground mining, working the derrick on the workover rigs, etc.). Compared to office work, of course, it’s definitely dangerous…unless you happen to be highly allergic to paper cuts or something.

    Anyway, yes, you might be able to “slip in the back door” by finding a company who would take you on at low or no pay for a while. I don’t have any specific suggestions in that area, but I do know that a man has an advantage when he pops in and says, “Here’s what I can do for you and why you should hire me (even if it’s for free). You win, and I get to eventually drive one of your trucks. ” I got my first exposure to the world of commercial computers that way. Walked into a service company in Great Falls, Montana, in 1967. At that time, they were still using COBOL and BASIC and punch cards; we’re talking the dinosaur years of the computing world. We cut a deal: I’d work for free for six months, learn on the job, and then graduate to a paid position.

    I did this because I KNEW computers were coming sooner or later, and this would be a whole lot cheaper than going to school for a year or two. In the end, I only lasted one week because (a) they were too busy meeting customer payroll deadlines and such to really instruct me properly, and (b) they had no patience when I didn’t pick up in a day or two what they’d been years learning. I walked in after lunch one day after one week on the job, told them I was outa there, and found out they’d been ready to give me the boot anyway.

    But the concept is still sound. It takes a fair bit of creative thinking and determined push sometimes, but it can be done.

    As for “hooking up”…I’d avoid the big chains if I were you. They’re pretty impersonal, at least in my experience. You’re not a person to them, just a cog in a wheel. I’ve had the best luck (this is only my experience, remember) with trucking companies that fielded somewhere between 30 and 700 power units (truck tractors), be that in the oil patch or over the highway. The real giants, for example Halliburton in the world of oil or Swift in the OTR (over the road) category, are rather miserable beasts. Getting on with them is not a bad thing starting out (I’ve been with both in the past), but you won’t want to end up there. Your life is not your own, and you’ll never end up making your millions.

    However, you might be onto something about opening a repair shop. For one thing, it’s sometimes easier to get hired as a mechanic as a young man (under 21) than it is as a driver. A repair shop with a reputation for solid work is never going to be out of fashion–not as long as we move our goods by truck, anyway. You will face inspections no matter what you do these days, and as a repair shop you’d be responsible for making sure the trucks you serviced could pass their inspections–but yes, that would in my estimation beat the heck out of having to manage route planning and the rest of it.

    Either way, once you’re ready to kick off your own company (whether it’s a shop or a truck fleet), one of the biggest challenges will be finding the right people to hire. In fact (duh), no matter WHAT type of business you’re looking at, that’s always a huge and frequently difficult challenge. Again referring to my last job (which was with a small enough company that I was able to keep tabs on all of it, pretty much), the owners had a lot of turnover in drivers AND in mechanics, and that was considered normal.

    I wish you and your family the best of luck in getting squared away to live and work here (in the U.S.). We have so many millions of illegal immigrants already that it’s downright refreshing to talk to somebody who’s actually going by the rules.

  7. Thanks again for the information 😉

    Where would I get experienced mechanics? Would I be looking for retired truck drivers? Are there courses/degrees in truck mechanics, based on the grades of which I could employ young mechanics?

    Also, if I understood correctly, Canada allows American CDLs within the country, and there are a lot of British emigrants moving to Canada and doing trucking, using International Driving Permits. Could I acquire a UK “heavy goods vehicle” license which lets me drive a vehicle up to *any weight* at 18, and then use it in the US?

    My mother told me she’d be able to finance a vehicle for me, which I would try my best to recuperate the costs with. If I’d want to travel around America, learn the highways and the routes, and then re-earn the monthly payments by delivering packages, what could you recommend? See if I needed $400 a month on financing, what could I do? Could I become an urgent-parts-needed-at-roadside deliverer?

    A UK license lets you drive a Peterbilt 379 (due to weighing just under 7.5 tonnes) without a trailer “for personal uses”. If I have a license allowing me to drive “heavy vehicles”, could I transport a tractor without a trailer?

    And finally… is trucking in Mexico/further down South dangerous? Do you get robbed? Do people begin to only speak Spanish after a certain point going south?

  8. Again, great questions. The answers aren’t always pretty.

    1. Finding experienced mechanics is not easy. There is competition for them. Mostly, employers pull them in through advertising job openings. If you also have a trucking company, some drivers may be interested in shifting to working as a mechanic in order to get more home time–it’s a rare man, though, who can make more as a mechanic than he can as a driver, and being a qualified driver does NOT automatically mean he’s a qualified mechanic. (For example, I was a top driver, either over the road or off road, but would have needed a whole lot more schooling to become a fully functional diesel mechanic.)

    2. There are definitely schools for truck mechanics, yes. I’ve not attended any, though (my first college years were for auto mechanics but not for the big stuff). If you Googled around, I’m pretty sure you’d find at least a few of them.

    3. Using an International Driving Permit for commercial driving in the U.S. is a tricky question. Mostly, no; every company I’ve ever worked for would NOT hire a driver on that basis, instead requiring the driver to upgrade by passing the tests and getting a CDL. However, I know from experience that SOME employers DO use International Driving Permits in this country. Unfortunately, they’re usually somewhat unqualified employers hiring illegal immigrants from Mexico to drive their trucks and running under the radar, basically violating not only U.S. regulations but also the state D.O.T. rules as well…and thereby hangs a tale.

    In 2008, in Colorado, I started one night shift (my preferred shift) with a full load of water to haul up six miles of steep switchback dirt road to the top of the Roan Plateau. Neither the guard shack at the bottom of Garden Gulch nor I could decide if the road might be slick enough to require chains or not–it looked like a rain shower had hit up there somewhere, but not down where we were. So they waved me on through.

    I was right at Mile Marker 2 when my truck started spinning its tires. It was time to chain up. I pulled as far to the right as possible and prepared to exit the cab to throw iron…when I saw a truck coming downhill, coming over a little rise, about 500 yards up the grade from my position. I studied his progress for a second or two and realized he did NOT have full control of his vehicle; the trailer was fishtailing a little, trying to decide whether or not to pass the tractor.

    I knew his vehicle would be empty…and I also knew he was highly unlikely to pass me safely. He just was not an expert for that type of road condition. So I stayed behind the wheel of my rig, set the parking brake, jammed the foot brake down full hard, got a good double grip in the steering wheel, and braced for impact.

    It took him about ten seconds or so to reach my position. He got the tractor past my tractor…but sure enough, as I’d predicted, the trailer slid over sideways enough to smash into my tractor’s left front corner.

    Well, like I said, he was running empty while I was buttoned down and fully loaded. My rig didn’t budge, but his bounced sideways like a Ping-Pong ball, going half off the road and into the trees.

    Due to his taking out my grille, left headlight, and left front fender, BOTH vehicles were immobilized from the wreck.

    Long story short, there was another driver for that company right behind this guy, but he got stopped safely. Their boss showed up, threw both of them in his pickup, and sped out of the gulch like the Hounds of Hell were on his tail. When he came back an hour later, he got two tickets–one for speeding past the guard shack and one for hauling his people away from the scene of the accident. But he managed to HIDE the IDENTITY of his drivers…and he ADMITTED to the Deputy doing the investigation that they were driving on International Permits, NOT CDL’s.

    So: Legitimately, no, International Driving Permits are not generally accepted in the U.S. for U.S. based commercial drivers…but there are a few lawbreakers out there who do operate that way.

    4. Traveling around America to get acquainted with the roads…that sounds like a pretty good idea. How to re-earn the monthly payments? That’s another story. You could become almost anything in the delivery business. One of the best (i.e. highest paying) services for a relatively small truck (one ton or even a heavy duty 3/4 ton pickup) towing a low, open topped trailer, is the “HOTSHOT” business in the oil patch. A hotshot driver gets a call from an oil company man who tells him, “Hey, there’s a particular tool sitting in Alabama that I need here in North Dakota YESTERDAY!” The hotshotter gets on it, runs hard, and delivers as quickly as humanly possible, any hour of the day or night (the oil patch runs 24/7, never shuts down). But how do you break into the business of becoming a hotshot driver? That I do not know; I’ve never tried it.

    5. I know what a Peterbilt 379 is like; I’ve driven them. But there is no license in the U.S. that allows you to drive “heavy vehicles” except the various classes of CDL licenses. There is no such thing as a “bobtail license” (tractor with no trailer). Here we are truly over-regulated; the red tape is depressing sometimes.

    6. About Mexico and farther south, I’m going to be blunt here: STAY THE HELL OUT OF THERE! Let me start explaining why with a quote from a CNN article:
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    “(CNN) — Here’s a look at what you need to know about the Mexican Drug War. The Mexican government has been fighting a war with drug traffickers since December 2006. At the same time, drug cartels have fought each other for control of territory. More than 60,000 people have been killed from 2006 to 2012, according to the most recent data available from Human Rights Watch.

    Facts:
    There are approximated 6,700 licensed firearms dealers in the U.S. along the U.S.-Mexico border. There is only one legal firearms retailer in Mexico.

    Nearly 70% of guns recovered from Mexican criminal activity from 2007 to 2011, and traced by the U.S. government, originated from sales in the United States.

    Ninety percent of the cocaine that enters the U.S. transits through Mexico. Mexico is also a main supplier of marijuana and methamphetamines in the U.S.

    Mexican drug cartels take in between $19 and $29 billion annually from U.S. drug sales.”
    ————————————–
    Mexico is extremely corrupt and extremely violent at this time in its history. Some of the killing is also spilling over on our side of the border. We live one mile from the border. In the past five years, we’re aware of a Senior U.S. Border Patrol being gunned down in a midnight gun battle 70 miles INSIDE our border, an area rancher being assassinated, and an owner of a small ghost town gunned down most likely just because he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. In the border states, we’re being seriously invaded, and the Obama administration pretty much encourages it. There are areas in Arizona where our own government “dealt” with the problem…by putting up signs warning Americans to stay out of certain areas IN OUR OWN STATE PARKS because the Mexican drug cartels basically control the drug running corridors. We’re losing our nation because of the President currently in office…and it’s MUCH worse in Mexico itself. Farther south, I prefer not to even think about.

    Being robbed might be the least of your worries in Mexico. Being beheaded is all too possible.

    7. If you do (despite my fierce warning) decide to go south anyway, one final item: It’s all Spanish once you cross the border into Mexico. You’ll find people who speak English here and there, but not as their first language.

  9. Hi
    I have a quick question…
    I have my own truck and tank as well.but i dont know how i can start my own company i mean like how to get contracts,or to start my truck working with rigs companies or batteries thank you

  10. The area shouldn’t make a whole lot of difference; whether it’s Texas or North Dakota, the oil patch is the oil patch.

    That said, were I in your position, I’d proceed as follows:

    1. I would NOT start trying to get my own contracts initially. There’s too much to learn, too many people to get to know, and it’s helpful to get it right the first time.

    2. I WOULD begin be finding out Who’s Who in the water hauling world in your chosen area (Pecos/Odessa in this case). That’s not as easy as picking up a phone book since most carriers (trucking companies) in the patch don’t exactly advertise in the Yellow Pages, but it’s not rocket science, either. Whether hanging out at a truck stop or a restaurant or driving around any old where, you’ll (a) meet people and (b) see trucks with names on the sides. So you start making a list–doesn’t have to be fancy; a spiral notebook will do–and then ask around until , for example, you find out the phone number for ABC Trucking Company.

    3. As you log these numbers in, you also schedule time in your day to call them, simply asking, “Do you or do you not take on owner operators.” Some do, some don’t. Also, some treat their leased operators quite well…and some don’t. Some don’t even pay them, so you also ask around to find out if ABC is one of the good ones, one of the bad ones, or somewhere in between. You do all this carefully, of course, making sure to make as few new enemies and as many new friends–or at least friendly acquaintances–as possible.

    4. As an alternative, there will be some companies who have terminals in your area with people on site who have the power to hire and fire and take on owner operators and such. When you find one of those, you might want to simply walk in, introduce yourself, and talk about leasing to their firm. Like any other sales job–which is what you’ve got, the job of selling yourself and your truck as a unit–there may be a ton of NO responses, but it only takes one YES>

    5. As you’re talking to these people, you’ll want to pay close attention. Are their terms such that you and your truck can make a living? How well maintained or poorly maintained do their own rigs seem to be? (Dirt is no indicator in the patch, but obviously neglected maintenance is a warning flag.)

    6, Then, once you get leased on with an outfit you can survive for a while, you still pay attention–AND you use your spare time (which will be minimal if times are good, but still) to expand your knowledge base. You find out how other small operators made it happen. Keep an eye out for ways to line up contracts without breaching any business ethics, etc. When you know you’re ready (after perhaps 6 months to a year of running for the other guy), THEN you make your move to set out on your own.

    Hope this helps.

  11. You did a great job of detailing the pros and cons of the water hauling in the oilfield business among other relevant details associated with trucking.

    I was also in that business and want to get started again. Now that Obama is out and Trump is in it’s a whole different ball game as long as oil holds around $50 a barrel and up. I am also a heavy equipment mechanic / welder and have a a class A license and experience in North Dakota driving truck in the winter time. I am also a former roughneck with 8 years of oilfield experience in Wyoming , Colorado, Utah. Even though I have been enjoying the sunshine in southern California and working as a heavy equipment operator for over 20 years my memories of Wyoming still linger and traveling through that state is always a comforting time to reflect back on. My plan is to start with one truck and find one capable driver to run 5+ days a week with me. I have a company giving me the thumbs up to come and negotiate a contract to haul… so… with $30,000 I should be able to make it 40 days to the first settlement check and start saving for the second truck to expand with after that. Anybody out there that wants to talk about the possibilities with me can post here and we sort it out from there. All the best to all of you in your trucking ventures wherever you may be.

  12. Thanks for your on-the-spot comment, Ted, and as you wished for others, the best of fortune to you in your entrepreneurial endeavors.

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